DJ Dep
refugee from the other place
We are talking about CARS. Not crazy people that jump off roofs. :crylol:
Rear spoilers
- Thread starter SuperBuickGuy
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We are talking about CARS. Not crazy people that jump off roofs. :crylol:
rtj
Well-known member
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Viper ACR is a street car running big wings, so I found a Motor Trend article:
First Drive: 2009 Dodge Viper ACR
Jurassic Lark: With 8.4 liters and overhead valves up front, the Viper ACR seems to be an old-school supercar. Until you drive it.
Most of the time, effort, and development dollars have been spent on stuff that makes the ACR go faster through the twisty bits-suspension, brakes, wheels and tires, and aerodynamics. Especially the aerodynamics. Just chew on this for a moment: At 150 mph, the regular Viper coupe generates 100 pounds of downforce; at the same speed, the Viper ACR generates 1000 pounds of downforce.
That giant carbon-fiber rear wing is the most obvious reason why. But there's also a new carbon-fiber front splitter that extends way back under the car and incorporates seven steps to diffuse the airflow. The new hood louvers unveiled with the 600-horsepower engine upgrade a year ago play a part, too. "We knew we were going to do a new ACR, so we moved the louvers forward to help change the aero balance of the car," says SRT boss Herb Helbig.
Squeeze on the power and feel the forces build. Feel, too, the aerodynamics squeezing the car down onto the track, keeping everything eerily calm. Helbig claims the wings 'n' things work from as low as 50 mph, and on fast sweepers the Viper engineers have seen a sustained 1.5g lateral grip. At 120 mph through Willow's long Turn 8 the downforce was like a giant hand, settling the car over a mid-corner bump that has machinery like 911s and M3 CSLs feeling a bit squirrelly.
First Drive: 2009 Dodge Viper ACR
Jurassic Lark: With 8.4 liters and overhead valves up front, the Viper ACR seems to be an old-school supercar. Until you drive it.
Most of the time, effort, and development dollars have been spent on stuff that makes the ACR go faster through the twisty bits-suspension, brakes, wheels and tires, and aerodynamics. Especially the aerodynamics. Just chew on this for a moment: At 150 mph, the regular Viper coupe generates 100 pounds of downforce; at the same speed, the Viper ACR generates 1000 pounds of downforce.
That giant carbon-fiber rear wing is the most obvious reason why. But there's also a new carbon-fiber front splitter that extends way back under the car and incorporates seven steps to diffuse the airflow. The new hood louvers unveiled with the 600-horsepower engine upgrade a year ago play a part, too. "We knew we were going to do a new ACR, so we moved the louvers forward to help change the aero balance of the car," says SRT boss Herb Helbig.
Squeeze on the power and feel the forces build. Feel, too, the aerodynamics squeezing the car down onto the track, keeping everything eerily calm. Helbig claims the wings 'n' things work from as low as 50 mph, and on fast sweepers the Viper engineers have seen a sustained 1.5g lateral grip. At 120 mph through Willow's long Turn 8 the downforce was like a giant hand, settling the car over a mid-corner bump that has machinery like 911s and M3 CSLs feeling a bit squirrelly.
turtlevette
The Turdle
Who takes corners at 150? I think the bottom line is the disgusting look of that huge wing vs the help it provides.
Those huge wings turn my stomach. I guess if you could do one that quickly detaches and use it just for racing.
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mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
:shocking: Good GOD, I agree with TV?? :shocking:
MYBAD79
Moderator
isn't the look just based on personal opinion? the downforce it creates is based on facts and physics..... if it creates 10x the downforce at 150 mph it sure does a pretty good job at lower speeds too....
now, while I agree that thing is buttugly .... I'd rather go fast around a track in a ugly car than slow in a pretty car
SuperBuickGuy
Well-known member
the car looks even uglier as it slides off the track and into the wall :1st:
and honestly, give me one valid reason why I should care about your tastes.... just one.:search:
Perhaps you can do a search and see what my response was to someone who told me I should sell the vette and buy a miata to go racing.... the same advice given that poster would apply quite equally to you...
turtlevette
The Turdle
super buick guy my ass, you'd run a grand national if you were serous instead of some old pos collector.
There in lies a basic difference between you and I.
Karston, The downforce is a nonlinear function. That's why the data point is at 150 to look really good. I challenge you to find any track where a weekend driver can take what's basically a street car through a corner at 100 much less 150.
Howard may be a gruff SOB but he's always right.
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turtlevette
The Turdle
It's called a knee point on a non-linear function. Even a half assed engineer knows that.
rtj
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Sorry, but if I were to get a new car right now it would be either a ZR1 or an ACR.
Heck, I saw a mini Cooper the other day with a wing and splitter. It was probably a college kid. It looked pretty good and probably safer than what I drove in H. School (340 Duster). At least the ACR is 600HP (respectable).
MYBAD79
Moderator
That Mini at Waterford ? I almost exhaled my coffee thru my nose when I saw that LOL
MYBAD79
Moderator
Who exactly told you that you should sell the vette? It was suggested you just get another better suited car for track days (AutoX) in addition to what you have .... so what's the big deal here?
http://vettemod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8511&highlight=miata+track&page=4
DJ Dep
refugee from the other place
Just a side note...but I heard the Indy cars have so much downforce that they could drive upside down in a tunnel with no problemo. I suggest anyone that installs a ricerwing test theirs out that way.
SuperBuickGuy
Well-known member
post 31 on that link
rtj
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That's probably the same one I saw, parked Five Guys. The one I saw was nicely done. Not for me, but to each his own.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Just a side note...but I heard the Indy cars have so much downforce that they could drive upside down in a tunnel with no problemo. I suggest anyone that installs a ricerwing test theirs out that way.
:hissyfit::nuts::3rd::clobbered::nuts:
THAT is funny as hell, I'm setting here in tears now, spilled my damn drink....
:bounce:
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
And here I am, with my beloved old girl friend the shark, so gets as much attention as my legal wife, and my wife has a '91 Miata parked right nest to it.....and I drive her Miata, manual steering and automatic quite frequently too, hate it with the top up, me way too tall....but the car itself is a blast to drive, not as much as my vette, but still WAY fun.....
:hissyfit::bounce:
MYBAD79
Moderator
I snapped a photo with my phone..... I agree, to each his own, it sure is not my cup of tea
phantomjock
Well-known member
Here's one way to deal with "low q."
High thickness to chord ratio - and add some high incidence (negative here) to take advantage of that large flap!
Sure 'taint purdy. But gotta be effective.
Form does follow function.
{hmmm - isn't that an interesting sentence we always choose? But logically it is written the other way 'round!}
Cheers - Jim
High thickness to chord ratio - and add some high incidence (negative here) to take advantage of that large flap!
Sure 'taint purdy. But gotta be effective.
Form does follow function.
{hmmm - isn't that an interesting sentence we always choose? But logically it is written the other way 'round!}
Cheers - Jim
SuperBuickGuy
Well-known member
has anyone done aero testing on a flat back window vette? more specifically, does the spoiler need to be above the roofline, or would a 80 up deck spoiler be as effective?
And yes, I do plan on up to 180 mph speeds.... and a sign on the back of my car that says "if this car is on a trailer, please call the police because it's being stolen"
Remove the spoiler? okay, where would you store it to get it to the track?
And yes, I do plan on up to 180 mph speeds.... and a sign on the back of my car that says "if this car is on a trailer, please call the police because it's being stolen"
Remove the spoiler? okay, where would you store it to get it to the track?
rtj
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If you are serious about it, this is what I'd do with a flat back window vette.
Make a smoke generator, cigar, pressure tank, sch 40 pipe, and some tubing. Drive down the interstate and bleed smoke into the airstream. Try to find the undisturbed air. That's the height I'd mount the wing.
In wind tunnels they use smoke wands that run on 120v and burn skywriter oil.