So, what if..............
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Your math is a little off. To generate $100 a month of electricity, I would need to "generate" 750kWh average per month, that is 30kWh per day. Let's say I get an average of 5 hours of full sun per day (optomistic for Ohio). So divide 30kWh by 5 and now I need to generate 6kWh (or 6000 watts) every hour I have sun.
The average installed cost of solar electric is $9.00 per watt. That's 6000 x 9= $54,000 ******* dollars (not $10,000). I will be 100 years old when I break even. Sorry, that's a deal breaker for me
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
Yes, someones math is off allright.
So. Cal. Edison is spending millions in solar in So. Cal., not because they have to, but because they want to. I gaurantee the payback is not 50 years, nor $9 a watt in cost.
With only 5 hours of daylight, I can see why your in the dark.
So. Cal. Edison is spending millions in solar in So. Cal., not because they have to, but because they want to. I gaurantee the payback is not 50 years, nor $9 a watt in cost.
With only 5 hours of daylight, I can see why your in the dark.
OK, tell me how I "generate" $100 per month of solar electricity for $10,000?
Look at this map and tell me that 5 hours per day isn't optimistic. Keep in mind that solar cells don't always point to the sun:
http://www.solarcraft.net/sun-hours-map.htm
DJ Dep
refugee from the other place
LOL...that's why he's called "Twin Turbo". He's got those windmills going in his engine. :rofl:
DJ Dep
refugee from the other place
Ahhhh....the Al Gore "carbon credits" theory. Unfortunately, Al Gore forgot about one thing. Capitalism and doing business in the USA. Besides the raw power, electric companies have other expenses to deal with. Things like line maintenance of transformers and paying the salaries of it's workers and buying those big high tension line towers, etc., etc. In New Mexico, where solar is the "in" thing in power since we get so much sun for so long, people are finding out there is a distinct downside to poking your nose into the business of the electric company. Our rates have skyrocketed ever since people started "going off the grid". The electric companies have also figured out this free electricity thing and have figured out how NOT to lose any profits from it. Got a surplus? No problem. They pay a LOT LESS for that surplus than what they CHARGE for that energy. So the "theory" of the more power you make the more you benefit goes right out the window. One guy in NM has actually got a special "power drainer" setup so that he DOESN'T make too much power.
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
The energy policy act of 2005, signed by BUSH in New Mexico, MANDATES net metering by the PUC. The price you PAY is the CREDIT you earn.
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
For all the nawsayers of green weenies, here is a free enterprise, privately owned success story:
http://www.biothane.com/en/articles/15613.htm
http://www.biothane.com/en/articles/15613.htm
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
How about one in Vermont? They also do this here in California:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-12-03-cow-power_x.htm
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-12-03-cow-power_x.htm
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
I guess you have to move here Larry. Those figures are from an actual install by a close friend of Vettezuki here in so cal.
As stated before, the costs and payback vary greatly by local and demand. Perhaps the economy of Ohio is shrinking, and not expanding, which motivates this usage the most.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
AND the money is leaving Kalifornia fast as it can too....
:harhar::lol:
:harhar::lol:
The estimate 5 hours of sunlight are more than you have in California. The solar cell doesn't even start "seeing" light until the sun is 20-30 degrees above the horizon. The link I provided above shows daily sunlight hours for the US. And, the map is provided by a company that sells solar equipment, so I would assume that it's pretty accurate (If they were to exaggerate, it would be to inflate the sunlight hour claim). There are tons of other site that list the same information.
As for the cost of solar panels. The current average installed cost is $9.00 per watt. The solar panels cost the same in California as they do in Ohio.
Jeff, I don't have anything against solar energy. If I could generate $100/mo of electricity for $10K, I would do it tomorrow. If the energy density of PV cells were to increase 500% (to get the cost to $10K), I think you would see them on every rooftop in America. Unfortunately, they have been averaging 3-4 percent per year.
I really think, in the future, fuel cells are the best alternative. Right now a 5kW generator is about $50K. Bloom Energy and a few others are saying that 10kW generator for less than $10K will be here in 10 years (10-10-10 plan). That's clean, 24hr a day power.
As for the cost of solar panels. The current average installed cost is $9.00 per watt. The solar panels cost the same in California as they do in Ohio.
Jeff, I don't have anything against solar energy. If I could generate $100/mo of electricity for $10K, I would do it tomorrow. If the energy density of PV cells were to increase 500% (to get the cost to $10K), I think you would see them on every rooftop in America. Unfortunately, they have been averaging 3-4 percent per year.
I really think, in the future, fuel cells are the best alternative. Right now a 5kW generator is about $50K. Bloom Energy and a few others are saying that 10kW generator for less than $10K will be here in 10 years (10-10-10 plan). That's clean, 24hr a day power.
010752
Well-known member
The best I've heard of is a machine shop in the northeast somewhere, beside a small river that adapted a water wheel to generate the juice for ALL of it's machinery, total independence and still is able to sell back to the power company in it's off hours.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
:drink: that's funny, my buddy with the old flower/grist mill on the creek in williamsport Md......do a google for Kemp's Mill there.....
he has some of the old gear still in place, the water wheel from 300? years ago is long gone, but the metal shafts...iron? still in place complete with a really old leather belt drive to a generator way in hell up top of the place....all the gears and peged differential gears still there in one spot or another, he made hanging lamps out of some of them.....
so there are guys that CAN generate their own electrickery....this generator had a commutator on it, not slip rings....so was DC output....
:shocking::shocking::gurney:
69427
The Artist formerly known as Turbo84
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That's great.
(I'm incredibly surprised that some government bureaucrat hasn't tried to shut them down for disturbing the migration of some silly snail darter or something.)
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Now you prompted the 'rest of the story' Dick Nye, owner of the mill above mentioned, ran into troubles with the Md. dept of fish and wildlife/something like that name...so they wanted him to tear down the damn dam he owned across the creek, well the way the deed is written for some 300? years now is that he owns the creek bottom about a couple miles in each direction, not the creek SIDE or the WATER, just the creek bottom...weird as hell, plus about 3 acres of the mill site, itself....and obviously the dam.....
SO, they wanted some fish to run upstream, and so they demanded a fish ladder be built, he asked how, they get back to him....so they run around in a .gov tizzy and after a couple years they get to him with some assinnine plan, but in the meantime he looks on the 'net and finds out how to build one, so he does, by himself digging with rented machinery, temporarily blocking flow, pouring concrete, and built a fish ladder.....about 6 steps/pools to it, right along the side of the old sluice way/building....so the fish were/are using it fine.....they come out to show him how to build one, he says it's DONE....so the head of the fish service comes out with the group, and the guy comments that it was the first time he actually had ever SEEN a fish ladder in use......so the head of the planning for Dick's fish ladder had never seen one in use....great.....
so having visually actually seen it in action, they approved HIS plan/execution...he spent maybe 2 grand on it....
He gets up early, goes out on the deck, about 2-3 stories above the water, looks over the edge when fish are going their thing, listens to them flip around, water of the dam, and lays back enjoying his coffee....not a bad life, with 12500' worth of space inside the joint.....
:drink:
Twin_Turbo
Der Maulwurf
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f'n rediculous
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Nice house, funky looking roof though.....oh well....:harhar::gurney:
that yours???:drink:
that yours???:drink:
Twin_Turbo
Der Maulwurf
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No, that's the house next to my buddies..the one I was talking about earlier. (post #90)..German license plate 
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
f'n rediculous
For free power, I could live with that.:devil:
big2bird
Charter Member, Founder Bird-Run, Cruise-In Bird-R
BTW, if anyone is interested, I found an online business that sells kits for DIY'rs for $3.50 a watt. Name brand equipment too.
mrvette
Phantom of the Opera
Ok 3.50/watt, my a/c alone is 3.5 tons...fused on the outside compressor for 30 amps....so 30 amps at 220 is `6500 watts figgering to include the air handler on that or 23 grand, and that don't count for any losses in converting the DC output to 60 hz to run my a/c.....
in heavy summer/winter being a heat pump....I pay 200/month at most now...
in the 'off season' it's closer to 100, with windows open for a month or more....
now looking at my last months bill my 'energy' bill is 4.1 cents/KWH.....
and out of that 207 bux bill, the 'energy part was 136 bux....then a 'power cost adjustment' of 50 bux...the rest is overhead....they nicked me .02840/KWH for that 'adjustment' amounts to a summer rate increase?? fuel cost?? whatEVER....
so really it's closer to 7 cents/KWH.....in summer and surely winter also....
I used 1739 KWH over 30 days.... and 6.5 KWH/hour that HVAC RUNS....
I can't justify 5 grand outlay, let alone any more....
:stirpot:
DJ Dep
refugee from the other place
I've been searching for this article and finally found it. Here's what's going on in NM:
http://www.alamogordonews.com/ci_15445690
http://www.alamogordonews.com/ci_15445690
