P/S rack in a manual mode?

69427

The Artist formerly known as Turbo84
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A poster (elsewhere) asked me if I still have power steering on my car, given its lighter weight compared to its original factory bulk. I said yes, but a manual rack (no pump weight) fitting my car is out of my budget. But that got me thinking. What is the steering response like (and any durability concerns) with a power rack plumbed into a recirculation mode (with just a modest amount of fluid in the lines for adequate lubrication).

Any input on this issue is appreciated.
 

rtj

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No issue I did that when I did the steeroids install. Big tires were no issue either. I drove in Fl for several years like that. Grand Am rack if I remember correctly.

There are probably some race r&p that are lighter.
 

69427

The Artist formerly known as Turbo84
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No issue I did that when I did the steeroids install. Big tires were no issue either. I drove in Fl for several years like that. Grand Am rack if I remember correctly.

There are probably some race r&p that are lighter.

The dollar cost per pound of weight reduction for a new rack is a bit much for my budget, hence my question above.

I'm assuming you just connected the original pressure and return ports together in your application? I'm thinking of doing that for a test drive around the neighborhood.
 

vette427sbc

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No issue I did that when I did the steeroids install. Big tires were no issue either. I drove in Fl for several years like that. Grand Am rack if I remember correctly.

There are probably some race r&p that are lighter.

I did the same thing... worked fine with a few track days, auto x’s and thousands of miles daily driving. I didn’t see or feel any additional play or wear when I pulled it out.
 

69427

The Artist formerly known as Turbo84
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Clinging to my guns and religion in KCMO.
No issue I did that when I did the steeroids install. Big tires were no issue either. I drove in Fl for several years like that. Grand Am rack if I remember correctly.

There are probably some race r&p that are lighter.

I did the same thing... worked fine with a few track days, auto x’s and thousands of miles daily driving. I didn’t see or feel any additional play or wear when I pulled it out.

Sounds good. How about the response? Any fluid dampening (like a shock absorber) feel when trying to steer quickly? I'm curious because if I get a sudden bit of oversteer, can I still catch it quickly with some fast effort on the steering wheel.
 

MYBAD79

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I installed the manual GrandAm rack, 3.7 turns lock to lock... it's cheap and awesome, search for my install thread.
I also have a GrandAm power rack (2.5 turns) but have not tried that yet.
 

rtj

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I don’t know about anyone else, but I dumped out approx half the fluid. Don’t crank the rack with the hoses off! I left some fluid in for lubrication.

It felt like a tight manual rack. Made my c3 feel closer to my c5z at the time (but manual).

How much will you save without ps pump? Should be significant.

Plus is a small HP gain from no parasitic pump loss.
 

69427

The Artist formerly known as Turbo84
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Clinging to my guns and religion in KCMO.
I don’t know about anyone else, but I dumped out approx half the fluid. Don’t crank the rack with the hoses off! I left some fluid in for lubrication.

It felt like a tight manual rack. Made my c3 feel closer to my c5z at the time (but manual).

How much will you save without ps pump? Should be significant.

Plus is a small HP gain from no parasitic pump loss.

I'm with you on leaving a little fluid in the rack to keep things lubricated.

The stock C3 pump was about 12# (with a big cast pulley). Years ago I replaced that with a Grand-Am type II pump (about 6#), and currently have an aluminum type II pump (about 4.5#). The pump weight is on the heavier left side of the car, and I could also remove the fluid cooler.
 

69427

The Artist formerly known as Turbo84
Joined
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Clinging to my guns and religion in KCMO.
I installed the manual GrandAm rack, 3.7 turns lock to lock... it's cheap and awesome, search for my install thread.
I also have a GrandAm power rack (2.5 turns) but have not tried that yet.

Yeah, I would have liked to have been able to use a Grand Am rack, due to its availability and price (and rearward weight location), but my C4 suspension is a front steer setup, so I have the worse of both worlds (more expensive rack and forward weight placement).
 

vette427sbc

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No issue I did that when I did the steeroids install. Big tires were no issue either. I drove in Fl for several years like that. Grand Am rack if I remember correctly.

There are probably some race r&p that are lighter.

I did the same thing... worked fine with a few track days, auto x’s and thousands of miles daily driving. I didn’t see or feel any additional play or wear when I pulled it out.

Sounds good. How about the response? Any fluid dampening (like a shock absorber) feel when trying to steer quickly? I'm curious because if I get a sudden bit of oversteer, can I still catch it quickly with some fast effort on the steering wheel.

Response was about as quick as I could turn a 13” steering wheel with 285 tires and ~5 degrees of castor. For tight autox courses I would have preferred a power rack. All other times the manual was great. No note able fluid damping. I had a very small amount of fluid in mine.
 

MYBAD79

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I installed the manual GrandAm rack, 3.7 turns lock to lock... it's cheap and awesome, search for my install thread.
I also have a GrandAm power rack (2.5 turns) but have not tried that yet.

Yeah, I would have liked to have been able to use a Grand Am rack, due to its availability and price (and rearward weight location), but my C4 suspension is a front steer setup, so I have the worse of both worlds (more expensive rack and forward weight placement).

then the Summit brand rack should work? I'm using it on my Fox body... think it's $300... and its not heavy...
 
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