Opinions on NASCAR changes?

[DJ Dep]

Those who follow NASCAR know that in 2012 they will be switching to fuel injection. I have mixed feeliings about this. While I like the idea of NASCAR finally arriving in the 21st century (actually late 20th century) as far as induction is concerned, I'm NOT crazy about how they're doing this. Instead of allowing the use of manufacturer-installed fuel injection, they are going to standardize on an aftermarket fuel injection to be installed on every car.
I'm sure the pros to this method are a more regulated competition and "keeping everyone on an even playing field". What hogwash!!! Why not just let the best factory system compete, and if it is junk, they lose? That wounld motivate factories to improve what they have and be a benefit to the consumer. Ford, Dodge, and Chevy already have high performance FI installed on Mustangs, Vettes, and Challengers. So development would have been minimal to make them race-ready. Standardizing on an aftermarket FI is of no help to the consumer. They can't change their FI to that system because it is illegal to tamper with it due to EPA regs and cars being tested for pollution.
Okay...feel free to post your opinions.

Dep

 

[mrvette]

It's about time they ditched antiquated tech....but they doing it stupid, and you are correct Dep.....no question....

Honestly, I would rather they run what they brung....stock ****, other than a roll cage....and the usual race prep...tires, suspension, brakes...etc...

 

[68L71]

NASCAR has been going down hill ever since they started eliminating short track races and turned completely gay after Dale died.

 

[racervette69]

NASCAR has been going down hill ever since they started eliminating short track races and turned completely gay after Dale died.

Since they moved the North Wilkesboro Race!!

 

[SMYDA]

You left out choice #3 ..... Don't give a rip either way ....

I think if they want to make it more interesting they need to switch directions
half way through the race and start making "RIGHT" turns. :huh::nuts:

Standardizing the FI with a non-OEM .... Aftermarket setup..... and then making
everyone buy it sounds a lot like "healthcare" ..... this must be another one of
Obama's ideas ..... :smash::stirpot:

 

[DJ Dep]

Well the race today sure looked like a "Noah's Ark" race. 2 by 2 by 2 by 2. I didn't care much for the large packs they'd had in previous years, but this crap is even worse. The only good thing was seeing a young kid 20 years old beat out all the pros and win. And in a Woods Brothers Ford, it was even more enjoyable. They even had it painted in a retro paint job like what David Pearson used to use. Pretty cool.

 

[rodeck350]

There's not one damn thing factory on those cars.

 

[Fuelie74]

There's not one damn thing factory on those cars.

What do you mean, Toyota uses a nine inch rearend in all of their cars!

 

[GT6Steve]

I was sound asleep on the couch and missed the marvel ending. NASCAR sucks now, just a high speed Spec racer series. Yawn, can you remember Sports Renault?

Put the STOCK back in stock car racing and show us something....Ain't gonna happen:zzz:

 

[BangkokDean]

$$$$$$$$$$:zzz:

 

[clutchdust]

I personally have little concern with them. Too little too late for me. I have very little respect for NASCRAP ever since they got away from any pretense of an actual production vehicle base. If they're going to have a tube frame race car then, by God, make a real, honest race car out of them. I want to see good tires, centerlock wheels, IRS, more than 4 gears, and, obviously fuel injection.
On that note, I talked with Ron Fellows at SEMA last year and asked him from his personal experience what a comparison between a NASCRAP "stock car" and a GT1 Corvette would be like. He said there simply wouldn't be any contest. The "stock car" is like an 850hp Suburban. The GT1 (and GT2) Corvettes have better brakes, better suspension, better tires, better weight, better aero, better fuel economy and of course, fuel injection.

 

[DJ Dep]

Of course, you guys are all correct. The cars in NASCAR today can no longer even remotely be considered "stock cars". They have become specialized "racing machines" designed for a specific purpose. The complaints and comparisons to sports cars are not very valid, though. The NASCAR cars weren't made to race like sports cars. You can see that in the ones that race at sports car tracks. They also don't COST anywhere near what a race-only sports car costs. Oh they are plenty expensive, no doubt about that, but not even close to the cars racing in the uper levels of sports car racing. And I doubt those sports cars could last 500 miles at a constant 9300 RPM, which is what was going on at Daytona yesterday. And those same sports cars are very fragile. One hit at the wall at 200 MPH and their day would be over. Many of the cars that got in wrecks yesterday actually finished the race and didn't do too badly either. So the comparison between sports cars and NASCAR cars isn't really valid. I agree that they should go back to what they were in the 60s. Stock bodies with factory engines. Back then a racer could go into the dealership and buy a race car, put a roll bar and seat belts in it, and go race at a track. Notice that in the Bush cars (or whatever sponsor they call them now), they have switched to using Mustang, Challenger, and probaby soon Camaro bodies. Thats a nice improvement over the body styles they've been using. There appears to be a trend towards bringing back the pony cars in the USA. Ford has brought back the Boss 302. Chevy has the SS Camaro (how long before the return of the Z28?), and Dodge has the Challenger R/T. Of course, they are so expensive that hardly anyone can buy them. And they go too fast for the safety freaks and gas to run them is going through the roof. I won't get into the ramifications of the current policies of no drilling for oil by this administration. Suffice it to say regular will soon be $5+ a gallon. Hard to justify driving anything that doesn't get 30 MPG.
NASCAR nowadays is more about the driver than the car. I guess that's the way NASCAR wants it. In the old days (and it still happens at drag races), people lined up behind the manufacturer. Didn't matter WHO was driving the car. Now they ask "which driver do you pick to win"? It's been this way at the Indy 500 for a LONG time because most of the cars were identical in performance. Now Indy is pitiful because they have ONE motor for EVERY car. Might as well name it the Honda 500. When they came down on the turbine at Indy, I knew that race was dead. No progress allowed.

 

[68L71]

I agree with most of what dep said. Let’s see how a GT1 Corvette does at Bristol or Darlington against the cup cars. I hate all the new tracks, basically tracks that both NASCAR and open wheel cars can race at….way too many speedways on the schedule for me. When they eliminated North Wilkesboro it was the start of the down hill slope. Then all the cool tracks that had two dates got cut to just one.

I am sure someone has more information, but didn’t some owners group of tracks buy up some of the old NASCAR tracks and then they had power to get races at their other speedway tracks...while eliminating races at the old tracks.

I go as far as wishing they would run a dirt track or two in the cup series. Money has ruined it. For me the only racing I watch now is a couple of races a summer at the local dirt track.

 

[clutchdust]

Oh, don't worry too much about a GT1 car on a short track, unless the "stock car" puts them into the wall while being passed.
I go back to the inherent problem with NASCRAP. My suggestion, which will be summarily ignored, is that the cars can run whatever engine/tranny combo they want, but they must use a production floorplan, at least 50% of which cannot be modified. Let them run a 5 or 6 speed transmission if they want. Hell, on the big tracks they may not think the extra weight is worth it and stick with a four speed. But seriously, why the hell are they stuck on 15" tires when even the sad production vehicle they're copying generally runs at least a 16 or 17" wheel?
My point is that if you're going to make a true tube frame racer, then make a real race car. If you're going to make a "stock car" series, there needs to be at least some "stock" in the cars.

 

[68L71]

Oh, don't worry too much about a GT1 car on a short track, unless the "stock car" puts them into the wall while being passed.

yeah well thats short track racing....

 

[DJ Dep]

Oh, don't worry too much about a GT1 car on a short track, unless the "stock car" puts them into the wall while being passed.

yeah well thats short track racing....

LOL...I would LOVE to see one of those delicate sports cars come apart after being "nudged" out of the way. Would be kinda funny to see the guy coasting to a stop while enclosed in nothing more than the frame. :rofl:

 

[redvetracr]

here is something to think about...the next time your out driving around or are in a big parking lot somewhere look to see if the Nascar stickers you see are of the same manufacturer as the vehicle they are on...chances are they are not. the car companies spend many millions on Nascar while Nascar promotes the drivers not the cars they drive...and no I didn`t watch more than the first 5 laps of the Daytona 500...boring :zzz:

 

[SMYDA]

I did some volunteer work at Talladega Motor Speedway in the early 90's.
Got to see Richard Petty race there for the last time. Haven't been to a
NASCAR race since let alone watch one on TV.

Thought I would try some Indy Car racing so I've signed up for some volunteer
work at Barber Motorsports Park for the Honda Indy Grand Prix here in Birmingham.
http://www.barbermotorsports.com/indy/index.php
Maybe it'll prove interesting ... we'll see.

 

[Ozzy]

Indy / F1 racing is the most boring crap on tv. Rather watch golf or bowling.

 

[SMYDA]

Indy / F1 racing is the most boring crap on tv. Rather watch golf or bowling.

You might be right ... I found NASCAR far more interesting in person than on TV. I also find being active at the races far more interesting than just setting there watching everything go by.

 

[DJ Dep]

here is something to think about...the next time your out driving around or are in a big parking lot somewhere look to see if the Nascar stickers you see are of the same manufacturer as the vehicle they are on...chances are they are not. the car companies spend many millions on Nascar while Nascar promotes the drivers not the cars they drive...and no I didn`t watch more than the first 5 laps of the Daytona 500...boring :zzz:

Actually, that holds for just about all forms of auto racing. NASCAR fans are some of the most loyal fans to SPONSORS as any that exist. After picking Trevor Bayne to win, and seeing him win, I felt the strong urge to put a #21 decal on my Chevy truck. Of course, the wife has a 2005 Ford Explorer, so it's not completely "wrong". And I am seriously considering trading the Chevy truck in on a Ford truck. That means I would be towing the Vette with a Ford. And that is NOT unusual for drag racers. I think probably drag racing is the last bastion of manufacturer support in racing. They still stir people up with "how many want to see the Dodge win, and how many want to see the Ford win". Although, like NASCAR, many of the cars only vaguely resemble production cars. That's why I like Pro Stock over any other form of racing. At least they use REAL steel bodies.

I suppose the "race on Sunday/sell on Monday" thing has long expired. People buy what they can afford or what they like. Personally, I wouldn't buy ANY "Government Motors" cars any more. Heck, the last GM dealership closed it's doors in my town back when they were doing the cash for clunkers fiasco.
And seeing Chrysler employees sitting in their cars in the parking lot drinking and smoking pot on our bailout money doesn't encourage me to buy Mopar.

 

[redvetracr]

That's why I like Pro Stock over any other form of racing. At least they use REAL steel bodies.

sorry to burst your bubble but NHRA pro-stock bodies are made of carbon fiber with small computer chips molded in so the teams can`t mod the bodies...and have been for some time now. as to the "win on Sunday sell on Monday" it`s been replaced with "win on Sunday RENT on Monday"...

 

[DJ Dep]

That's why I like Pro Stock over any other form of racing. At least they use REAL steel bodies.

sorry to burst your bubble but NHRA pro-stock bodies are made of carbon fiber with small computer chips molded in so the teams can`t mod the bodies...and have been for some time now. as to the "win on Sunday sell on Monday" it`s been replaced with "win on Sunday RENT on Monday"...

Okay...I stand corrected. But they ARE the same dimensions as the factory bodies. They aren't "stretched" like funny car bodies.

 

[daveL82]

FI doesn't really matter because as mentioned the cars all run the same spec racer rules. NASCAR has lost the plot and I don't know why a car company would sponsor any of it. The only thing that resembles a street car is the sticker on the front with the brand name so you would know what it is. The Chevy vs. Ford vs. Dodge vs. Toyota thing is a joke

After watching the pushing of two cars the only thing I could think of was the Top Gear shows when they had one car on top of the other and the driver on tp had steering and the one below had brake and throttle. Might as well have a 10 lap race. How is NASCAR helping sales?

Cheers for the young guy winning but they will be talking about it on every NASCAR show for months on end. Anything to hype the sport.

I still enjoy my F1 racing for pure technology but really want to see a return to more stock bodied cars. Yeah a flares, spoilers etc... would be fine. The Australian Supercar V8 series is a great site plus they look like real cars and have all the safety equipment underneath.

 

[clutchdust]

Indy / F1 racing is the most boring crap on tv. Rather watch golf or bowling.

Huh? Indy maybe. 'Cause most of their tracks are just NASCRAP circlejerks. F1 is fantastic racing.

 

[DJ Dep]

FI doesn't really matter because as mentioned the cars all run the same spec racer rules. NASCAR has lost the plot and I don't know why a car company would sponsor any of it. The only thing that resembles a street car is the sticker on the front with the brand name so you would know what it is. The Chevy vs. Ford vs. Dodge vs. Toyota thing is a joke

After watching the pushing of two cars the only thing I could think of was the Top Gear shows when they had one car on top of the other and the driver on tp had steering and the one below had brake and throttle. Might as well have a 10 lap race. How is NASCAR helping sales?

Cheers for the young guy winning but they will be talking about it on every NASCAR show for months on end. Anything to hype the sport.

I still enjoy my F1 racing for pure technology but really want to see a return to more stock bodied cars. Yeah a flares, spoilers etc... would be fine. The Australian Supercar V8 series is a great site plus they look like real cars and have all the safety equipment underneath.

I tried to like F1 and Indycars....they do nothing for me. The Australian cars don't look like anything I see on the streets in this country. That idiot plan to rebadge the Hold-On Molaro or whatever they call it into a GTO was a dismal failure. The prototype sports cars look like something from area 51, and the lower class cars are just long lines of Porsches with gigantic wings. I tried to watch the American Le Mans because of the Vettes entered. But it's a chaos race with putt-putt cars racing among rockets. Looks like they are trying to duplicate rush hour in a big city with all that slower traffic.

 

[clutchdust]

See, that's what I don't understand. But I guess that's, like the old saying goes, what makes the world go 'round.
I personally love the ALMS series for exactly that reason. Think of it kind of like "bracket" endurance racing. Sort of. I love watching the prototypes running with the GT cars. It's like getting three or four races for the price of one. I've even thought it would be interesting to see NASCRAP try something like that with their cup cars, Busch sereies cars and something like the ARCA cars at the same time. Might make the circlejerk more interesting.

 

[DJ Dep]

See, that's what I don't understand. But I guess that's, like the old saying goes, what makes the world go 'round.
I personally love the ALMS series for exactly that reason. Think of it kind of like "bracket" endurance racing. Sort of. I love watching the prototypes running with the GT cars. It's like getting three or four races for the price of one. I've even thought it would be interesting to see NASCRAP try something like that with their cup cars, Busch sereies cars and something like the ARCA cars at the same time. Might make the circlejerk more interesting.

LOL...well if I had to drive a race where you got putt-putt cars racing with rockets, I dang sure want a nice big air horn installed to blast them out of the way.
To me, the purest form of racing is the drag race. You don't have to wait hours or even days to see who the winner is. The noise is absolutely awesome. The smell of nitro-methane is horrendous and wonderful. Huge, smokey burnouts. And you can get right down in the pits and up close and personal with the racers and mechanics. I was close enough that I was able to just reach out and shake John Force's hand and wish him good luck. In NASCAR and other racing styles, everything is kept at distance. Drag racing is "all American" because it pretty much originated here. It's street racing on a track. You can paint a number on the window of the family sedan or pickup truck with shoe polish and have at it if you so desire. Can't do that with ANY other form of racing. LOL...I wonder how many Mustang GTs were/are rented on Saturday for the sole purpose of beathing the heck out of them on Sunday at the strip? :nuts: