What if....

1

1Michel

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Saint Joseph du lac, Québec
What if instead of using HB, just install 4 new calipers from Willwood and a new non assisted brake booster???

Would this would make things better or worse????
more or less drivable???

In the past, I had a few cars with non assisted brakes and they wernt that bad, and not Wilwood quality.

I dont want to know about the advantages of HB, just curious about non assisted brakes but using new Willwood binders and master.

Just curious.
 
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I have had similar thoughts, but with NO standard of comparison, was reluctant to give it a GRAND worth of bux on a bet it maybe right....

still having the basic laws of fizzicks, so much pedal pressure to engage rotors, and put X pressure on them to stop car, car weight being ~3300 lbs, takes X pressure and since liquids don't compress, it translates to Y drag over said rotors, that led me to question just how changing calipers would make any significant difference for a STREET vette, not a balls out racer....

AND so I have never understood the purposely soft power brake pedal feel/travel of the typical GM/most other cars....

they always stopped, I guess....but never liked that typical 4" of pedal travel....

and everyone hates me for it, but HydroBoost solved the issues, pedal travel maybe 1/2 and hard as a brick....my foot modulates the brakes not some sucky vacuum system......

:smash:
 
You get in feeling what you loose in power.
More feeling : less chance you lock the tires
Less power : you'll brake a strong as you leg can deliver.

I went the HB way because I really didn't like the feeling of braking at low rpm, when vaccum booster wouldn't boost much.
I remember standing on the brake pedal.
At higher RPM the brake were rather strong and firm.

What is done it done, I won't change it before I first give it a try.
I got the PS pump pressure reduction kit, I'll lower the pressure enough to get a rather manly braking and steering.
 
denpo said:
You get in feeling what you loose in power.
More feeling : less chance you lock the tires
Less power : you'll brake a strong as you leg can deliver.

I went the HB way because I really didn't like the feeling of braking at low rpm, when vaccum booster wouldn't boost much.
I remember standing on the brake pedal.
At higher RPM the brake were rather strong and firm.

What is done it done, I won't change it before I first give it a try.
I got the PS pump pressure reduction kit, I'll lower the pressure enough to get a rather manly braking and steering.
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Dennis, you have hit on the krazyness of it, and all the comments about HB and even Rack/Jeep-Borgeson conversions....and that revolves around the pump pressure and volume as controlled by those bolt on parts on the pump output, when I went to serpentine drive when buying the car in '95 , I had to change the pump from that O ringy doo to a good old flare fitting like was on the car...so I changed it out with the old shit that was on the car from stock....I THINK it was the whole assembly, pretty sure it was, still have the old OEM pump with some of those brass parts setting in a cabinet here....

All I know is that when going to the rack ten years ago, It worked fine, and then adding HB it still feels good turning or braking....

now just exactly WTF I did to get there, I can't remember, that damn pump been on there working fine since it was installed....so all I can say is to mess around with it, and there has to be some combo that works good....

Jim Shea maybe knows the parts by looks, but I don't.....

:surrender:
 
despite the install snafus - my Wilwood D8 and slotted/vented rotors will stop my car on a dime and give you 9 cents change....

they are, however, power assist - but as I have a motor that develops little vacuum, I can guess what they'd be like without the assist - you could live with them, I'd certainly get the softest pad available.
 
SuperBuickGuy said:
despite the install snafus - my Wilwood D8 and slotted/vented rotors will stop my car on a dime and give you 9 cents change....

they are, however, power assist - but as I have a motor that develops little vacuum, I can guess what they'd be like without the assist - you could live with them, I'd certainly get the softest pad available.
Click to expand...

Oh, like I said, I had cars without assist in the late 70s, even some with drums in the rear, they all braked fine and they wernt Willwood quality stuff on them.

I was just curious.
 
I had no assist wilwoods on my 68 and they worked great. Really the best part was the unsprung weight difference...the wilwoods changed the feel of the car drastically for the better.
 
68L71 said:
I had no assist wilwoods on my 68 and they worked great. Really the best part was the unsprung weight difference...the wilwoods changed the feel of the car drastically for the better.
Click to expand...

Are you actually noticing this in Daily driving, or racing??

:twitch:
 
68L71 said:
mrvette said:
68L71 said:
I had no assist wilwoods on my 68 and they worked great. Really the best part was the unsprung weight difference...the wilwoods changed the feel of the car drastically for the better.
Click to expand...

Are you actually noticing this in Daily driving, or racing??

:twitch:
Click to expand...

Street driving....
Click to expand...

A GRAND for calipers and what all, over what I suspect the average shark has SS lined calipers from years ago already, then to note that on the street??

IMO, not for a grand....

:twitch:
 
mrvette said:
and everyone hates me for it, but HydroBoost solved the issues, pedal travel maybe 1/2 and hard as a brick....my foot modulates the brakes not some sucky vacuum system......

:smash:
Click to expand...

If you want to have truck brakes on a sports car, power to ya.
The Blue Devil has vacuum assist.
The ZO-6 has vacuum assist.
No Corvette EVER came from the factory with truck brakes.
I have locked my stock vacuum assist brakes up at 100 MPH, and slid straight as an arrow.
I hate to think what would have happened with ONE TON DUALLY BRAKES.
But, it's a free country.
 
I'd like to drive a C3 with a hydro boost. If it felt ok, i'd put one in. I actually have a used one in the garage from years ago but never got around to installing it.

Someone who has decent skills can drive anything on a track. You just have to learn the feel. Adapt to what you're driving.
 
I have owned several diesel trucks over the years. And they all had HB brakes. I don't like them. I think the vac brakes work better and feel better.
 
kwplot34 said:
I have owned several diesel trucks over the years. And they all had HB brakes. I don't like them. I think the vac brakes work better and feel better.
Click to expand...

I just can't get over the 4" maybe + of typical pedal travel to stop the car, and then being able to plant my foot on it well beyond that to the floor, and that is typical of all GM cars with vac booster, even Fords and Mopar....I have the HB on both the vette and Motor home set to about 2" of travel, and after that NO amount of force will floor the pedal.....

I have never driven a shark with manual brakes, so I can't compare, I just guess they feel the same, except for the obvious assist....

Curious about you guys that have manual brakes, how far does the pedal travel to get lock up? and after that, can any additional force move the pedal to the floor??:twitch:
 
I have manual brakes and the pedal is hard...it doesn't travel far to start braking and lock em up. Never been close to getting it to the floor. I have only had to lock em up a couple of times over the years.
 
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