More steeroids mods

Twin_Turbo

Twin_Turbo

Der Maulwurf
Joined
Mar 5, 2008
Messages
7,575
That steeroids system was still giving us headaches, flexing brackets, notchy steering, squealing sounds near end of steering and so on.

Today I decided to put an end to this BS once and for all.

I noticed that after only a couple of miles (car is barely used) the passenger side bracket was a little bent already. Simply ridiculous!! Thin gauge POS brackets...what a waste of money.

Problem is, what to do? Didn't feel like tearing down the whole shebang again and fabricating new brackets. I did that already for the drivers side outer bracket.

Here's the dr. side:

24896006ab27d0.jpg

Apparently that wasn't enough so I had to take drastic measures. I welded a big ass reinforcement straight to the frame! This may not be something everyone else is willing to do but this car isn't going to be converted back anyway.

So, here it is, think this will be strong enough? The stock steeroids bracket bolts to it with 2 bolts, drilled additional holes in the steeroids bracket. Also, it's made so the steeroids stuff can still be removed vertically down, so no issues with headers and all in case it needs servicing.

Still need to spray on some underbody goop so it matches the (yucky sticky) rest :) I ground off a bunch of it and the rest caught on fire LOL

24896006c13c6f.jpg

24896006d8ddfb.jpg

24896006edbfbd.jpg
 
TT, the PASS side?? my brackets are so much less than anyone else's and yet mine been on there holding that same rack for years now....

on the PASS side, there is NO need for lateral support, just hold the damn end of the rack vertically and fore/aft wise....the tube can slide along that bushing with no effort at all....

on the driver's side it's much better to grab that bracket by the bottom U clamp bolt and bring it to the frame with a simple as hell 1/8 thick 1" wide steel bar bent into position U seen my brackets over the years I would think, NO??

Hell I just used two of the old mounting bolts for the driver's side, and then ONE of the old steering ram bolts....done deal....

All this bullshit about them fucking brackets from countless guys, and now you got troubles too??? jeezus....

:eek::tomato::suicide:
 
I know it can slide. I'm going to test this, if it does not work, but I'm hoping it will (the rubber donut is clamped down real tight) I'm going to fabricate a removable crossmember that bolts this solid welded mount to the removable one on the drivers side, effectively tying the 2 sides together. See, I purposely left room behind the steeroids bracket for a crossmember/bar to fit there, it can run under the pan without clearance issues

I don't know how you drive your car, but if you do some spirited driving, it's all over the place and the feel gets notchy when the stuff deflects. No amount of adjusting the heim will correct that.
 
Twin_Turbo said:
I know it can slide. I'm going to test this, if it does not work, but I'm hoping it will (the rubber donut is clamped down real tight) I'm going to fabricate a removable crossmember that bolts this solid welded mount to the removable one on the drivers side, effectivly tying the 2 sides together. See, I purposely left room behinf the steeroids bracket for a crossmember/bar to fit there, it can run under the pan without clearance issues

I don't know how you drive your car, but if you do some spirited driving, it's all over the place and the feel getts notchy when the stuff deflects. No amount of adjusting the heim will correct that.
Click to expand...

I used just TWO universals on the input, my rack is tipped up for the input gear to be close enough to the engine mount horn in the rear there so I cut out a crescent from the lower back lip to clear the input universal/bolt, I have no crazy adjustment problems having collapsed the steering shaft which was loose anyway and sliding it up was easy with a couple hammer taps....the junkyard provided all the parts I needed for my two universal setup and it was easy to make up the needed joints/couplers by typical universal joint repair methods....

I drive hell outta the thing, and have NEVER had that steeing hang up or do anything rong the way you describe it, I think steeriods is fucked up man, no question the design sux, and so I did mine almost concurrently with theirs, and had mine on the road when they were still in 'testing' with theirs....having never seen their system...

BTW, I don't think much of the VBP system, which is essentially slightly modded steeroids design either....saw it last winter on their display at Kisseeme here.....

have you seen my bracket setup???

I dunno if I have any pix saved from old computer or not, maybe on the thumb drive....if not....well, I can take more....

:amazed::amazed::cussing::thumbs:
 
I've seen your brackets, your rack also is mounted higher most likely.

The steeroids stuff is simply junk, and the bad part is, they won't even admit it. What baffles me is, that so many people rave about it, and some have a lot of problems. IMO, it must be that those who like it either are in complete denial or don't drive the car hard enough.

No way 2mm steel plate is thick enough to withstand the lateral forces of an assisted rack.
The double universal is a POS too. The problem is, it's not my car. My buddy bought the system with good hopes of having a sportier fee. What he removed was a perfectly fine stock steering box with fresh VB&P parts and no slop in the box. I'll say this, the steering feel of the box was ten times better than the rack as it is. In fact, it's a little scary to drive, it feels notchy when you corner hard. it must be the whole rack moving an then the double universal is binding.

We just installed it as is because no sane person it going to cut up an expensive kit. However, initial feelings were..this is junk and it's going to haunt us, and be damned it did. Then I initially modified the drivers side bracket, since that's where the loading takes place. Well, it helped a bit, but not enough.
 
Twin_Turbo said:
I've seen your brackets, your rack also is mounted higher most likely.

I really don't see how my rack can be significantly higher on account of it has to clear my stock oil pan and of course I did have to tap on it a bit for clearance of the bellows only, but jeez a 1/2 inch???

The steeroids stuff is simply junk, and the bad part is, they won't even admit it. What baffles me is, that so many people rave about it, and some have a lot of problems. IMO, it must be that those who like it either are in complete denial or don't drive the car hard enough.

Only personally seen ONE install, something 69myway, Chris McDonald, did just down the road a piece about a year before he got transferred further south, I miss visiting him as he was VERY creative....would have LOVED to get him to help redoo my '72 paint.... the install looked good, but I didn't drive the car.....I don't recall any feedback....


No way 2mm steel plate is thick enough to withstand the lateral forces of an assisted rack.
2mm is nearly 1/8 inch, no?? 25.4 MM/inch so .1 inch or so, nearly an eighth...that is what steel is in my brackets, it's not the steel, it's the way it's used....swear....I even have a VBP cross support up front to eliminate any frame tower flex....my rack support brackets have to weight about 20% of anything else I seen...yet, with just TWO input universals I have no problems, and I think that's the rub and that 'notchiness' coming in from frame flex and those universals and some 'issues' everyone complains about we flex that frame, one wheel up and the other down either way, and those universals of their are in troubles....too much angle on the dangle and so it gets notchy....


The double universal is a POS too. The problem is, it's not my car. My buddy bought the system with good hopes of having a sportier feel.
with 2.7 turns lock to lock vs 3.7 for stock there is no way in HELL it's not sportier feeling I don't give a damn about the complaints about road feel and assist and pumps and crap....I have plenty of road feel, course I have 17"x9.5 inch '92 vette wheels on there for some 15 years now too....it's all in the rubber....


What he removed was a perfectly fine stock steering box with fresh VB&P parts and no slop in the box. I'll say this, the steering feel of the box was ten times better than the rack as it is. In fact, it's a little scary to drive, it feels notchy when you corner hard. it must be the whole rack moving an then the double universal is binding.

We just installed it as is because no sane person it going to cut up an expensive kit. However, initial feelings were..this is junk and it's going to haunt us, and be damned it did. Then I initially modified the drivers side bracket, since that's where the loading takes place. Well, it helped a bit, but not enough.
Click to expand...

Shit, I would use a cross support between A arms, then try for adjusting them universals to some position by jacking one wheel then the other and trying for steering feel...remove tires, stick on jack stands and then jack on side/other at a time while turning the wheel....flex HELL outta that frame much as you can get your bro to sit on it if the rear comes up.....

:beer::beer::bonkers::mad:
 
This car already has a spreader bar. The flex is not in the frame, it's in the brackets

You have 2mm brackets? I thought you had square tubing? if so, 2mm square tubing is a whole lot more rigid than a simple 2mm plate with a dinky little bend in it. It's doubled up where the heim goes through. If you grip it with an adjustable wrench for instance, it takes absolutely NO effort to bend the bracket.

They should call this hemorrhoids because it's a PITA!!!!!!!
 
Twin_Turbo said:
This car already has a spreader bar. The flex is not in the frame, it's in the brackets

You have 2mm brackets? I thought you had square tubing? if so, 2mm square tubing is a whole lot more rigid than a simple 2mm plate with a dinky little bend in it. It's doubled up where the heim goes through. If you grip it with an adjustable wrench for instance, it takes absolutely NO effort to bend the bracket.

They should call this hemorrhoids because it's a PITA!!!!!!!
Click to expand...
:D:D:D

Thanks for the laugh, that was a good shot:hunter:

yeh, all my brackets are is just 1" angle iron from hardware store, 1/8 thick, I had it left over from some BDSM gear I used to build with my welder buddy and so he made a box out of it, and so I just had him weld it up the way it worked when I used nothing but clamps to hold it all together, took two attempts to get the driver's side right, but the pass side was really simple only mod on it was to straighten out the tab on the clamp and shove the bolt in vertically to get it above the A arm and NOT a lo point....I do have that rack tucked up fairly snug, but it does not touch that oil pan, and is in there level so I dunno I still think the whole thing is simple as shit compared to what in HELL I have continually heard on ALL forums about that steeriods install.....

course I would not bet good bus MY install would fit another vette, as hell even the bodies don't fit 1/2 the frame consistantly and tranny tunnels need widened like for my 700/200 install but other guys don't have to bother....makes me wonder.....

:stirpot::sos:
 
Your brackets have what the steeroids ones lack, they have "wall height parallel to the bending moment", as in at least 2 of the sides of your tube are resisting the bracket from bending sideways, on the steeroids stuff a silly little bend has to do that. As such they don't offer anywhere near the stiffness that yours do.
 
Twin_Turbo said:
Your brackets have what the steeroids ones lack, they have "wall height parallel to the bending moment", as in at least 2 of the sides of your tube are resisting the bracket from bending sideways, on the steeroids stuff a silly little bend has to do that. As such they don't offer anywhere near the stiffness that yours do.
Click to expand...

EVER so much clearer stated than I could put words together.....correct....

not that I really thought of it, but I just went for the simple pimple straightforward workable approach on account of I"m LAZY.....

and so my welder buddy does all the hard work, I think up shit, and he gives me shit over hard shit, and so it goes.....:stirpot::stirpot:

I got another question about a 350 chebby engine...another thread....


:fishing:
 
It improved the steering quite a bit, the rack still moves a little but noticable less and the steering feel is a good bit better also. Still not perfect (or what I would have expected from a 1600$ kit) but it's better than the way it came out of the box now.
 
How much movement is there in the rubber mounts? I saw an ad for replacement poly mounts for a R&P. Must be a common problem.

The moment on the mount plate (where the Streeroids plates mount to the frame) must be really high. Is there a way to run a tension rod from both mounts to the opposite frame rail?
 
About half a centimeter still, most of it is in the rubber mounts. Where did you see the poly mounts? I'll have to try those then.

That tension rod, that's just what I'm going to do..apart from the tensioning part :) , and that's why I left some additional material behind the bracket on the welded section. I'm going to mount a rod from left to right so the drivers side bracket is supported by the passenger side welded piece.
 
Twin_Turbo said:
About half a centimeter still, most of it is in the rubber mounts. Where did you see the poly mounts? I'll have to try those then.

That tension rod, that's just what I'm going to do..apart from the tensioning part :) , and that's why I left some additional material behind the bracket on the welded section. I'm going to mount a rod from left to right so the drivers side bracket is supported by the passenger side welded piece.
Click to expand...


TT, way I see it, trying to visualize under my car, is you don't have room to get a bar below the oil pan from the very bottom of the driver's mount to the pass frame rail....going laterally is useless....just to another support without lateral stiffness.......

eh, I think that over, you did laterally support the pass side...hummm....

fuck it....tear it all out and do it my way, and get on down the road a piece....

:crap::lol::lol::fishing::suicide:
 
It's not going to the frame rail, it's going to that big bracket that I welded on the passenger side. Check out the 2nd, 3rd and 4th pic in my initial post. That bracket, I left some room at the back that can easily be modified to accept a bolt on brace. This will run to the bracket in pic #1 and bolt to it. Nothing to it, plenty of room.

I'm not tearing it all out, with that last bar added and maybe some urethane mounts (can't find them @ summit damn!! have running order there) this thing should be tight as it can be.
 
Twin_Turbo said:
It's not going to the frame rail, it's going to that big bracket that I welded on the passenger side. Check out the 2nd, 3rd and 4th pic in my initial post. That bracket, I left some room at the back that can easily be modified to accept a bolt on brace. This will run to the bracket in pic #1 and bolt to it. Nothing to it, plenty of room.

I'm not tearing it all out, with that last bar added and maybe some urethane mounts (can't find them @ summit damn!! have running order there) this thing should be tight as it can be.
Click to expand...

Well, maybe a cam under the car watching while I drive....I maybe in for a SUR prise....but I dunno, what with that rubber bushing I pulled outta the junkyard with the rack....but on the driveway, or garage floor, turning the wheels still looks good....I realize dynamic loads have to be FAR greater, but I hope I not rong with my observations.....one of my watch list modifications so I tune in on any thread about C3 and rack steering...

:hunter::stirpot:
 
Twin_Turbo said:
About half a centimeter still, most of it is in the rubber mounts. Where did you see the poly mounts? I'll have to try those then.

That tension rod, that's just what I'm going to do..apart from the tensioning part :) , and that's why I left some additional material behind the bracket on the welded section. I'm going to mount a rod from left to right so the drivers side bracket is supported by the passenger side welded piece.
Click to expand...

This isn't the poly mounts I saw but here are some for a Mustang:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Prot...013QQitemZ230278330113QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
 
turtlevette said:
mrvette said:
[I had it left over from some BDSM gear I used to build with my welder buddy
Click to expand...


what kind of stuff did you used to make? Any pictures. Maybe in another thread.
Click to expand...

Ahh, years ago, the 'company' folded, expensive shit, all steel and solid woods, damn little plywood, top cabin stuff.....

St. Catherines wheels, wall mounted, a long horizontal table with a stretching rack on it....and a cage under, lacing tables, suspension bars, jail cells to be hung up in a nightclub, St. Andrews crosses out of 4x4's with 4" sq steel tubing in the center, and wooden X extensions inserted....both free standing on a 4x4 plywood sheet or lean to on a wall, variety...we also modded one to spin, wall mounted....he did the welding/painting, I did the woodwork....we used various woods depending on what the customer wanted....mainly pine and cypress.....this stuff had to be all finished down smooth and well rounded/designed for obvious safety concerns....which really came into play with the guillotine which LOOKED extremely REAL, but it was a long table about 18" high with a 7' drop/poles/guide posts on the blade,....stocks for the head and hands the blade was aluminum all bolted into the steel guides and layered up with wood to look great and provide some extra support too....it had 3 absolute safety stops in it forcing the blade up into the wooden portion, obviously, the SMACK it made when dropped would definately be heard above a typical band in a nightclub....

we spend a whole lot of time on that puppy, only made 2 of them, with a LONG list of maintenance checkouts, and customers had to sign for that one all legal like so we could not be sued for some jerk not doing HIS/HER job to ensure safe operation.....

Various leather works was farmed out to a fellow in the trade....our stuff was all KD...knock down and stored in a typical closet fairly easy....didn't say it was lightWEIGHT however....

Used to have some pix of me strapped on the spinning cross and wheel for a test ride at the club, way before it opened...

interesting times, those projects.....:shocking::beer:

anything holding a person, was tested with 3-4 200+ lbs guys on the machine and manhandling it pretty good, our shit did NOT BREAK....

there were some other smaller projects but totally forgetable, those are the highlights....

:1st:
 
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