Choices,choices machine work more expensive then expected

Imo Apita

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 28, 2009
Messages
244
As usual hit another speed bump in my 383 build.
Have been quoted $750+ by two local machine shops for 030 overbore, freeze plugs, oil galley plugs etc etc.
That's about double of what I expected to have to spend.
I planned on my '74 2 bolt 030 overbore and a main stud girdle.

Here's the kicker; I can have a 4 bolt 383 block ready for assembly delivered to my door for $795.

Just days ago I found a 400 block, 2-bolt , 060 over bored but needs finishing machine work $450 delivered to my door. Needs final honing and plugs so $300.
They only sell 060 overbore so no option for 030 or 040.
They clean, check for cracks and overbore but no mention of remaining wall thickness.
According to their website they use these blocks for their own HP builds.

So here are my choices:

  • Stick with my '74 2 bolt and spend $750+, run it with main stud girdle
  • Order the 4-bolt ready for assembly $750+
  • Order the 2 bolt 400 w/060 overbore and run it with main stud girdle $750+

I'm leaning towards the 400 (413) even though the rotating assembly will be about $200 ($999) more then the 383. Aluminum heads will be $80 more with steam holes so app. $875/pair with SR cam springs.

So the money I need for the 700R4 is gone. Which means a couple of months delay.

Advise anybody?
 
Some years ago I got lucky on buying out a kid's project here, so got a truck factory 4 bolt 355 engine, for like 350 bux...took it back to the machine shop that did the work, had it assembled as a short short block, I put in the torquey cam and it's had several sets of heads on it since....

thing is, 15 years ago it was about 650 bux into the short block, then more for the cam, and then of course heads....:clobbered:

I would go the 355 route again....gas at 5 bux/gallon soon enough.....

:clobbered:
 
I agree with Carb Doc on this one. Wouldn't even consider a 400 that's already .060" over.
Between the two 350 blocks though, I would probably choose the 2 bolt block. There are mixed opinions but I have heard from reliable sources that the 2 bolt block is every bit as strong, if not stronger than the four bolt block. If you really want a four bolt block, the best thing to do is bet the aftermarket splayed caps.
 
you can buy a 1pc rms roller block for 800 - new from Summit or seasoned and machined 030 over.
machining a old block is not cost effective unless you have a buddy who owns a machine shop.
 
machining a old block is not cost effective
I know (now)..that's the aggravating part.
SBC seems to be worth the cost of the machine work, nothing more.
Which is :crap: 'cause I was hoping to save a couple of hundred here and there for the 700R4.
I'm starting to look at Craigs list again so i can save on the shipping.
 
I went thru the exact same thing when I wanted to get my 350 machined and stroked.... machining the old block was $700, a new block was $700... a seasoned (.030" over) roller block was $800.... a rotating assembly was around $1000 ... now the ASSEMBLED short block SHIPPED was only $2100 :huh::huh:

a no-brainer .... :mobeer:

I bought a short block from MR engines in Glendale CA, even incl shipping across the US it was a good deal. They were great to work with so I had them install my cam as well, they matched Summit's price on cam, roller lifters and spiders.... plus install (which wasn't much as they had the engine anyways).... :trumpet:

Unless you really want to do it yourself and enjoy this kinda stuff it does not make sense to machine an old block and do it yourself...

Looking at it from a shop's perspective: they really don't make much money on it either.... it's taking quiet a few hours to machine it if you want to do it right.....
 
You're right about it not being cost effective anymore. When I built my engine four years ago, I compared the cost of building myself versus buying an assembly. I chose to build and by the time I was done it ended up costing me several hundred more than if I had just bought. Even so, I'm not disappointed because there were things I wanted to do that you just won't find in one of those assemblies. Not only that but I do take pride in the fact that I built that engine myself and it rocks.
 
I agree that nobody is going to do a good job as you do yourself. All shops are working for profit and that's pretty much all that most of them are looking for... very few take a lot of pride in their work...
that said, things like the polished lifter valley on RED's engine.... as beautiful as it is, how much would you want to pay for that ? How many hours does it take to polish the entire area like RED (Mike) did ??? 10-12 hours ??? Even at only 60$ an hour that's a good chunk of cash if you had to pay a shop to do this....
It is a great level of accomplishment but it takes a lot of time and commitment :thumbs:

Now, even after I had the short block assembled and shipped I still had to buy pushrods ($90) and head bolts ($60) - both ARP, head gaskets ($30), oil pan gasket 1pc, ($30) ... all that small stuff that nobody thinks about adds up.... timing chain cover f.e. is another $60..... boy, is this a great hobby :D
 
ok, back to the OP questions .... the main caps with the angled bolts are cheap but expensive to install.... fuggetabouthat... (my opinion)

I'd go with a seasoned 4 bolt main roller cam block and make it a 396 (if I had to do mine again this is what I'd do), forged stroker kits for 396ci are available :D

would be nice to slap the 396 badges on the hood or fender :D :D

Got to keep in mind that the 396 is a lot more expensive than a 383, the rotating assembly alone is $1500.... :cry:

So the most cost effective option is to go with a 383, cast crank and hyper pistons - that short block is available for less than $1200.... .060" over of course.... personally I would not want anything more than .030" over but that's just me ... those 383 short blocks with only .030" overbore are still way under $1800 assembled...

Did you already buy a 383 rotating assembly ???
 
I agree that nobody is going to do a good job as you do yourself. All shops are working for profit and that's pretty much all that most of them are looking for... very few take a lot of pride in their work...
that said, things like the polished lifter valley on RED's engine.... as beautiful as it is, how much would you want to pay for that ? How many hours does it take to polish the entire area like RED (Mike) did ??? 10-12 hours ??? Even at only 60$ an hour that's a good chunk of cash if you had to pay a shop to do this....
It is a great level of accomplishment but it takes a lot of time and commitment :thumbs:

Now, even after I had the short block assembled and shipped I still had to buy pushrods ($90) and head bolts ($60) - both ARP, head gaskets ($30), oil pan gasket 1pc, ($30) ... all that small stuff that nobody thinks about adds up.... timing chain cover f.e. is another $60..... boy, is this a great hobby :D

But see, that's exactly the kind of work that I wanted done. Granted, mine didn't look anywhere near as nice as REDs did, but I did a lot of that kind of work to my block. Knocked off all the casting flash inside and Glyptol'd the block and heads, fitted a crank scraper, other little things that maybe don't make a huge difference, but it's those little differences that add up.
And you're right, I wouldn't want to pay someone else to do that stuff. But me sitting in my garage at night after work with my Dremel and a Coke. That's unwind time. Then when the car cranks up that first time, it just puts a smile on your face (until the car stalls, runs over your foot and you have to spend 10 days in the hospital. But that's a whole different story.)
 
But me sitting in my garage at night after work with my Dremel and a Coke. That's unwind time. Then when the car cranks up that first time, it just puts a smile on your face (until the car stalls, runs over your foot and you have to spend 10 days in the hospital. But that's a whole different story.)


I had one nip my toes once, but no injury......but over 40 years ago, there was this guy from N.C. that came to Maryland and opened up a shop, Hank Lauderbach of Lauderbach Jet? drives for boat racing....that was Hanks' father....

So anyway, Hank has this Anglia, with a cammed up chebby, and Powerslide tranny, so near end of the work day he calls this customer to pick up his car, parks it outside the open garage door....so he messing with the Anglia, it pops into reverse, takes off like a bandit right into the side of the customer's car.....

he quick calls the customer, excuse of about parts and a shop confusion with another car....and got super lucky as the guy was on his way out the door....

3 days later the car is picked up all nice and new again....

except for your FOOT, that's the all time worst I knew of.....

:cry::flash::goodnight:
 
Guess what I just found on the local Craigslist:

350 Chevy Block 4 Bolt Main - $650
Date: 2011-02-23, 12:10PM EST


Block has been baked and blasted
All threads have been taped
Square Decked .015
Bored and Plate Honed .040
New Cam Brgs and Freeze Plugs installed
Hot Tanked and ready for Assembly
Can be notched for 383 stroker crank
Fillmore Machine

That's like 4-5 miles up the road, being sold by a machine shop.
4 bolt block for less then the cost of labor quoted by another shop.
 
looks like a good deal. They also offer to clearance for a stroker crank. I assume its not a roller cam block ?
 
Guy just called me back, Gen 1, 2 piece RMS has several.
030,040 and 060.
Going to take a look tomorrow or Saturday.:yahoo:
 
You might want to look at what you can get in pistons, you may be in for a bigger surprise there, again in a small block stay away from .060" over unless it is for Drag Race only, even there this is marginal, .060 is Good in a Big Block, to be avoided in a small block.
 
I'm looking at 040 maximum.
Looking at a balanced rotating assembly from Skip White at $750 with forged pistons (Not the KB hypersplinter pistons). Kit price is the same 030 or 040.
Still intend to use a main girdle just in the case I build something remotely successful and want to go nitrous at a later stage.

I'm gonna see the guy this afternoon and I'm excited....

***UPDATE*****

Went to see the guy. One man shop.
Took the time to talk to me for an hour and a half.
Explained to him what I was looking for ...383..300 RWHP blah blah blah.
Told him what I'd bought already as in roller lifters and roller rockers
Eventually we agreed on the following:
  • Line hone
  • Deck
  • Bore w/torque plate
  • Cam bearings/freeze plugs
  • Notch for stroker crank
my 2-bolt block for $700.

It all turns out to be 6 of one or half-a-dozen of the other.
4-bolt Summit block 030 overbore to my door for $773.
My block for $700 with the stud girdle that I already bought for $763
His (original ad) block without align hone for $650.

Whatever, I pulled the trigger and will bring him my block tomorrow morning.
Support your local business.
He's an ex swamp buggy racer, seems to know his engines, took the effort to give me the time of day....doesn't want a down payment...he get's my business.

We'll see, fingers crossed.
 
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That's a good deal incl the line honing with your girdle. That's the splayed main caps, correct ?? Is drilling the additional angled holes and tapping the threads also included ??? If so it's a great deal :thumbs:
 
That's a good deal incl the line honing with your girdle. That's the splayed main caps, correct ?? Is drilling the additional angled holes and tapping the threads also included ??? If so it's a great deal :thumbs:


Negatory, my 2-bolt regular main caps, bored/honed with stud girdle in place.
The man says a 2-bolt w/stud girdle is just as strong as a 4-bolt.
And good enough for my HP goals..400-450 at the crank.

BTW he said what all of you have been saying;
Don't go 060 on a SBC 350, absolutely don't go 060 on a SBC 400.
He's been looking for a 400 block that is usable for a year.
Now I know that you knew that you were right but sometimes it's nice to hear that you were right.

How the hell am I going to get that block in the back of my wife's SUV by myself?
It's time for a beer..or two...:mobeer:
 
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